Big Eden (2000)
Today, we're diving into the heartwarming film "Big Eden," which tells the story of Henry Hart, a successful gay artist who returns to his small Montana hometown to care for his ailing grandfather. The main takeaway here is about letting go of past romantic ideals to embrace new possibilities—and boy, does Henry have a journey ahead of him! As he reconnects with his childhood friend Dean, he also finds unexpected affection from Pike, the local store owner. The film beautifully portrays a small town that offers a surprisingly supportive community, where love can flourish against all odds. Whether you're a fan of LGBTQ cinema or just looking for a feel-good story, "Big Eden" reminds us that love and acceptance can be found right where you least expect it. So grab your popcorn, settle in, and let’s explore the themes of love, identity, and belonging!
Takeaways:
- The podcast dives into the charming world of 'Big Eden', showcasing how a small town embraces diversity and love, creating a heartwarming narrative.
- Listeners are treated to a nostalgic trip through the year 2000, discussing significant cultural shifts and personal anecdotes that resonate with many.
- The film 'Big Eden' serves as a touchstone for LGBTQ representation in cinema, illustrating how community acceptance can pave the way for love.
- Humor is woven throughout the discussion, with playful banter about childhood memories, movie references, and even a few cheeky remarks about ice cream and arcade games.
- The podcast highlights the importance of letting go of old romantic dreams to embrace new relationships, echoing the film's central theme.
- The hosts reflect on their own experiences with hometown dynamics, revealing how returning home can bring both comfort and tension in navigating past relationships.
Transcript
Well, hello there, everybody.
Speaker B:Hello.
Speaker A:Good Saturday afternoon as Matt and I are just taking our lunch breaks and.
Speaker A:Yeah, okay, it's all clear.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The boss has left.
Speaker A:Okay, so here we are at the.
Speaker A:The threshold of summer.
Speaker A:And the kids, of course, are enjoying themselves.
Speaker B:I'll be glad when they go back to school.
Speaker A:Oh, so won't we all.
Speaker A:But time, it just goes on.
Speaker A:And I've got.
Speaker B:I have to clean that ice cream drips off of those arcade games one more time.
Speaker A:Yeah, I. I know the feeling.
Speaker A:And those popsicle sticks have been all over the place and the wrappers and.
Speaker B:And they don't even buy them.
Speaker B:They just steal them out of the case.
Speaker B:Like we're not going to know.
Speaker A:I hear that the truck driver owes something to Lula May, but I won't tell you what.
Speaker B:Well, they wouldn't be able to get a hold of him if Lula May didn't, well, take up his time while he's here, I mean, right.
Speaker A:Exchange some favors.
Speaker A:Party favors.
Speaker B:Oh, well, it's the eggman.
Speaker A:This AC isn't working very good in here and, well, I don't know how much I can keep us going on this lunch break.
Speaker A:So we're gonna get to it.
Speaker A:Here, look at this.
Speaker A:I suppose.
Speaker A:Oh, I wonder when we are.
Speaker A:I am.
Speaker A:I'm seeing that.
Speaker A:Well, people are still able to get into the airport and say goodbye to their loved ones.
Speaker A:So I don't think terrible thing September 11th has happened quite yet.
Speaker A:But one of the Bushes is in the White House and I'm not talking about the older one, so I've got a feeling that we're.
Speaker B:I got a feeling that's gonna be.
Speaker B:Go ahead.
Speaker A:That's okay.
Speaker A:That's a New Year's song, by the way, in case you didn't know.
Speaker A:Or at least it's popular at New Year's anyway.
Speaker B:Popular?
Speaker B:Gotta be Fox.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker A:Oh, you and your new release movies there.
Speaker A:Let's get in the schedule.
Speaker A:Here we are a few.
Speaker A:A few calendar pages closer to present day.
Speaker A:Go figure.
Speaker A:We.
Speaker A:That never happens here, but let's find out when we are.
Speaker C:Good afternoon, time travelers.
Speaker C:Today.
Speaker C: You are in he year: Speaker C: to chaos during the contested: Speaker C:The tech driven optimism of the late 90s cracked as the dot com bubble began to burst, signaling the end of an era.
Speaker C:The year Also brought significant cultural losses, including Peanuts creator Charles M. Schultz and screen legend Walter Matthau.
Speaker C:Amid the upheaval, a new generation arrived with the births of future stars Addison Rae and rapper Ice Spice, ushering in voices that would come to define pop culture decades later.
Speaker B: Well, that's the year: Speaker B:But I'll tell you a quick little story.
Speaker B:Charles M. Schultz is responsible for my sense of humor growing up because I grew up reading penis books.
Speaker B:I dreamed that he and I had a chat, and then the next day, I found out that he had died the day earlier.
Speaker B:Oh, I think he came to me in a dream and said, you're welcome.
Speaker A:Peanuts was the favorite of my family's, too.
Speaker A:I watched all of the TV specials, of course, when they were rerun, and I. I have a childhood memory of Peanuts because one of the first coveted items in our household was a calculator that my sister had purchased.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker A:Yeah, a light blue calculator.
Speaker A:It was also high tech because it had the little solar, but it was Peanuts.
Speaker A:It had Snoopy and Woodstock on it, and I just thought that was so cool.
Speaker A:So whether or not my sister let me borrow it, I had it more often than she did.
Speaker B:When I was born, they put a Snoopy doll in my crib.
Speaker B:So growing up, I carried this Snoopy around, and I still have what's left of him.
Speaker B:Like, literally tatters, but I still have him.
Speaker A: Oh, so: Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So let's.
Speaker C:I believe your.
Speaker B:Your former co host is a.
Speaker B:Is a big, big Snoopy fan as well.
Speaker A:Oh, yes, I do believe so.
Speaker A:Mr. Smelly is an art enthusiast.
Speaker A:In fact, a student of art might say.
Speaker A:And Charles Schultz is exactly a favorite.
Speaker B:So, yes.
Speaker B:Something we share.
Speaker A:Well, people were the sort of outgoing type of person, and maybe we're thinking of something to do on a Friday night, a date night.
Speaker A:They might be going out.
Speaker A: t on Friday back there in the: Speaker B:Now that we've unwrapped that fish, let's see what's playing.
Speaker B:Okay, so how the Grinch Stole Christmas, starring Jim Carrey and a bunch of other people that we don't care about.
Speaker B:Oh, except for Christine Baranski, who I absolutely adore.
Speaker A:She's from Buffalo.
Speaker B:That's great.
Speaker B:I bet she shoveled off there, right?
Speaker B:No, I absolutely love her.
Speaker B:And then we have Mission Impossible 2, starring, well, Tom Cruz and other people.
Speaker B:And then we have oh, Gladiator, Russell Crow, Joaquin Phoenix, and Connie Nelson.
Speaker B:Well, loved it.
Speaker B:The Perfect Storm.
Speaker B:Starring George Clooney, Mark Wahlberg and Diane Lane.
Speaker B:We like Diane Lane.
Speaker A:I was gonna say there's two people in the cast that.
Speaker A:That's worth seeing for, but Mr. Mark Wahlberg, he can go sell his burger somewhere else.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:Oh, Meet the Parents.
Speaker B:Ben Stiller, Robert De Niro and Terry Polo.
Speaker B:It was okay.
Speaker A:Yeah, but didn't it also have.
Speaker B:What's your name?
Speaker A:No, no, no.
Speaker A:I'm trying to think of her name.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The gal who is famous for selling candles that are weird scents, and she was the Gwyneth Paltrow.
Speaker A:Gwyneth Paltrow's mom.
Speaker A:Gwyneth Paltrow's mom from Mom.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Was in Meet the Parents.
Speaker A:Oh, she played Ben Stiller's mom.
Speaker B:Huh.
Speaker B:That's interesting.
Speaker B:As long as it's not Gwyneth Paltrow.
Speaker A:No, it's Gwyneth Paltrow's mother.
Speaker A:And it's terrible that I don't have her name because she's a celebrated actress,.
Speaker B:But really sad that we don't have something that work.
Speaker B:We could actually look that up.
Speaker B:Let's see, Gwen.
Speaker B: It is to the year: Speaker B:So there is a computer around here somewhere.
Speaker A:I mean, you could crank up that phone line.
Speaker B:I know It'll take about 10 minutes to actually connect to the Internet, but.
Speaker A:Yeah, and we still have some of those coasters laying around here.
Speaker B:You're thinking of Blythe Danner, I believe.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Blythe Danner was in Meet the Parents.
Speaker B:Yeah, she's pretty awesome.
Speaker A:Oh, and she was in one of my favorite LGBTQ movies to Wong Fu.
Speaker B:Was she?
Speaker A:I thought she was.
Speaker C:She.
Speaker A:She was one of the townspeople.
Speaker B:Oh, that's very cool.
Speaker B:That's another movie we should, like, add to our pride thing next year, because I haven't seen that in decades.
Speaker A:Oh, yes, Small town stuff.
Speaker A:And Pride Month, of course, we're in July now, but Gopher Gulch is one of those weird little places where we.
Speaker B:Eventually lasts for months and months.
Speaker A:We eventually get the back issues of the magazines in the doctor's office.
Speaker B:Yeah, the ones on the top shelf.
Speaker B:Oddly enough, the adult magazines are next to the Do I do it yourself?
Speaker B:Selection.
Speaker B:So I don't know.
Speaker A:I think one of Lula May's friends did that organizing, so I.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:We ought to figure out what we're gonna talk about today.
Speaker A:I'm pretty sure it wasn't one of the top five movies in this.
Speaker B:It's not Mission Impossible, too.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But I'm hoping it's a movie with heart.
Speaker A:Let's see.
Speaker C:Today, in honor of LGBTQ Pride Month, you're watching Ari Gross and Louise Fletcher in a heartwarming romantic drama about a man named Henry Hart.
Speaker C:Henry is a successful gay New York artist who returns to his rural Montana hometown to care for his ailing grandfather.
Speaker C:Surrounded by a remarkably accepting community, Henry reconnects with old friends and discovers unexpected love with the shy general store owner, who offers both healing and a renewed sense of belonging.
Speaker C: It's: Speaker A:Oh, that sounds promising.
Speaker A:I don't think I've ever seen this one.
Speaker B:Really?
Speaker A:Oh, and that sounds.
Speaker B:We had it here for.
Speaker B:For a pride movie.
Speaker B:What do you call it?
Speaker B:Like a movie, Like a festival?
Speaker B:Yes, thank you.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:The movie.
Speaker B:The gay movie festival.
Speaker B:We had it here.
Speaker B:Actually, my other podcasting partner, Don't Tell Tom, was the one that brought it to us, and it was a loved, loved film.
Speaker A:I bet you he's a huge Nan Martin fan.
Speaker B:I don't know who that is.
Speaker A:Oh, she's the sweet lady that was supposed to be the one who could cook, but we'll get into that more later.
Speaker B:Oh, yes.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Thank you for reminding me.
Speaker B:I love her.
Speaker B:She's so funny.
Speaker A:Oh, and talk about funny.
Speaker A:And some of them are funny looking.
Speaker A:Those children.
Speaker A:They're in the alley again.
Speaker A:Rewind through time into movie night blockbusters.
Speaker B:Indies in black and white.
Speaker B:From 80s thrills to silver screen dreams trapped in the past by a time machine.
Speaker A:Each time the door for DJ&M to explore the lore.
Speaker A:The past is present and you're gonna want more.
Speaker B:I really love our theme song.
Speaker B:I mean, it just captures the vibe.
Speaker B:It's very MST3K meets Doctor who.
Speaker A:Yes, and a little cuckoo.
Speaker B:Alrighty.
Speaker A: Oh, so: Speaker A:Well, we should explain things.
Speaker A:Sort of set the stage.
Speaker A:And in the ways of Shakespeare, there's three acts to anything that's being told for a screen or on a stage.
Speaker A:So let's get into it.
Speaker A: In big Eden from: Speaker A:He's a successful gay artist living in New York City.
Speaker A:Course, where else would you live?
Speaker A:Who returns to his small hometown of Big Eden, Montana, which isn't so big.
Speaker A:And after learning that his grandfather has suffered stroke, Henry plans to stay only long enough to help care for him.
Speaker A:But returning home forces him to confront unresolved feelings about his past.
Speaker A:Like why he left.
Speaker A:He's reunited with Dean Stewart.
Speaker A:Of course, it's not going to be John Smith, but Dean Stewart, a childhood friend that he once loved.
Speaker A:Henry connects with the close knit community.
Speaker A:He left Behind.
Speaker A:Meanwhile, Hike.
Speaker A:Dexter, a quiet local store owner, secretly harbors feelings for Henry.
Speaker A:The central problem is Henry struggled to let go of old hopes, open himself to new possibilities, and find where he truly belongs, both emotionally and romantically.
Speaker B:So that.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That is just the beginning, folks.
Speaker A:You take your seat.
Speaker A:You've got your popcorn and your beverage, and find out that this guy who has moved himself to the hustle and bustle of the big city, well, he's got to go home because the house of cards has fallen down.
Speaker A:So there's the setup and the problem.
Speaker A:And I will begin discussion from.
Speaker A:With you, Matt.
Speaker A:Yeah, I'm asking you this question, sir.
Speaker A:So Henry returns to Pig Eden, expecting only to care for his grandfather, but instead finds himself reconnecting with his past.
Speaker A:How would you feel about returning to your hometown after many years away?
Speaker A:Would it be comforting, stressful, or a mix of both?
Speaker B:Well, my hometown, I only had, like, five.
Speaker A:You were a military brat?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Really?
Speaker B:No, it's.
Speaker B:It's basically up the street.
Speaker B:If we're talking about, like, my.
Speaker B:Yeah, but nobody.
Speaker B:Well, maybe one family that I ever knew still lives there.
Speaker B:So it would be like nobody knows me.
Speaker B:Nobody who cares, basically.
Speaker B:So, yeah, so I wouldn't care, but, I mean, I don't want to live there, though, because there are.
Speaker B:They're all nuts.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're not.
Speaker A:We're not discussing a Barbra Streisian film, Matt.
Speaker B:Hey.
Speaker B:I was gonna say.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, that's such a good film.
Speaker B:I actually did a monologue from that film and got laughed at.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:So apparently I wasn't a believable hooker anyway.
Speaker A:Oh, well, they didn't catch you on the right night,.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker A:Would it be comforting, though, to.
Speaker A:To be there and.
Speaker B:No, no, no.
Speaker B:They all.
Speaker B:They all suck.
Speaker B:I mean.
Speaker B:Yeah, the.
Speaker B:Well, I mean, I wouldn't know anybody from any of those places anymore.
Speaker B:They wouldn't really.
Speaker A:Do you have any change?
Speaker B:So much.
Speaker A:Do you have any trauma from there?
Speaker A:Like, when you come up to that intersection where the store was that you used to go to for lunch, and.
Speaker B:Oh, my goodness, the first house I grew up with, like, 1 to 10.
Speaker B:I mean, there's some trauma, but it's not like.
Speaker B:It's just like, whatever, but my formative years, my early teen years, that town, Auburn, I have a lot of bad memories and.
Speaker B:And a lot of.
Speaker B:I was treated really horribly, and that's where, like, life just went bad off the rails.
Speaker B:So, yeah, I. I mean, I wouldn't want to.
Speaker B:I would not want to go back.
Speaker A:And at all it's your version of Maple Drive.
Speaker B:I don't know that film, but.
Speaker B:Oh, it's Elm Street.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was a Jim.
Speaker A:Jim Carrey movie called Doing Time on Maple Drive.
Speaker B:And I, I don't think I've seen that one.
Speaker A:Oh, well, maybe that's next year.
Speaker B:But no Jim Carrey.
Speaker A:No, this is actually not a comedic role.
Speaker A:For a change, he.
Speaker A:Oh, then he might be right.
Speaker A:Well, I'm gonna turn the microphone around onto myself here.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Return.
Speaker A:Returning to my hometown after years away.
Speaker A:Gee, I don't know how that would feel.
Speaker A:I've only talked about it a few times.
Speaker A:So basically I went back for one of my high school reunions and didn't feel like having a sequel.
Speaker A:Although there is a sequel being made of the Romeo, Michelle's movie that we watched earlier this year.
Speaker A:I'm actually more excited about that than I am about the idea of going to another reunion, if you can imagine.
Speaker A:But I went to my high school reunion and it wasn't actually in my hometown because I, I come from one of those small places where they don't have enough money to do a dedicated reunion for just that year's class.
Speaker A:So they have a party and they invite everybody and whoever shows up, shows up.
Speaker A:So we basically got together and had our own off site event where we went to dinner.
Speaker A:And my version of going home was running into people and hearing all their stories about who was divorced and who has kids and is paying alimony kind of thing.
Speaker A:But for me, returning home was stressful because growing up in a time when we didn't have the right to be married, and I grew up in a small town, conservative area in the rurals, I call it the haystack.
Speaker A:Sometimes it was stressful because before that reunion I came home for a bittersweet time.
Speaker A:It was actually after my father's funeral.
Speaker A:And so as the youngest in my family, and some of you out there in listener land might relate to this, as the youngest member of the family, it was my responsibility as the unwed to child to spend time with my mother during the grieving.
Speaker A:So I of course lived with mom and took a part time job at the time to make it through that period.
Speaker A:And I ended up reuniting with my ex, which I probably wouldn't have done if I had more clarity.
Speaker A:But I needed to get out of Dodge.
Speaker A:So that's how much I enjoyed being back in my hometown.
Speaker A:So it was stressful.
Speaker A:There was some comfort, but I just hitched a ride out in the end.
Speaker B:Well, that's good.
Speaker B:It's interesting that you say high school reunion because like if I went back, I didn't actually go to high school, but I went to school enough with those the same people.
Speaker B:So if I went to a reunion, like high school reunion with those people that I went to school with, girl, I would be telling some truths.
Speaker B:I am very different now than I was back then.
Speaker B:And they all knew, most of them knew that I was gay, but they had called me another word for it.
Speaker A:Oh, yes.
Speaker B:And I still didn't even know at that time.
Speaker B:I just was like, why are they calling me that?
Speaker B:I don't know what that is.
Speaker B:Oh, it's.
Speaker A:It's the word that the Brits use for cigarettes.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:No, no.
Speaker B:Well, yes, okay.
Speaker B:Yes, absolutely.
Speaker B:But let's just say that, yeah, I would be telling some people what I really thought of them.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So although they'd probably be very different now and be all like, oh, we accept you, we're all embracing.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:We, we have friends that are like you.
Speaker A:I'm sure you do.
Speaker A:When was the last time you talked to them?
Speaker B:Right after we met them in the alley.
Speaker B:But don't tell my wife and my ex wife and my other ex wife and my 20 kids because we all got pregnant right out of high school.
Speaker A:And none of the kids have the same parent.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Well, and that's the thing in the town I grew up in that I'm talking about now, you were either stinking rich or dirt poor.
Speaker B:And no matter what you did, you were going to get pregnant right out of high school, get married and be stuck in a dead end job.
Speaker A:I can relate.
Speaker A:Where I came from, basically, if you were in high school, the job that you got was just to pay enough to put gas in your car to get to work.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So, Matt, I turned the microphone around onto myself, but how about take it back?
Speaker A:And you asked me the next question.
Speaker A:That was the setup and problem.
Speaker B:So, D.J.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:One of the film's central themes is letting go of old romantic of an old romantic dream in order to see new possibilities.
Speaker B:Have you ever found yourself holding on to an idealized version of the past?
Speaker B:And how did Henry's situation make you feel about moving forward and embracing unexpected opportunities?
Speaker B:So let's start with.
Speaker B:Have you ever dealt with this?
Speaker B:The ideal version of the past?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So?
Speaker A:Well, I, interestingly enough, I did have a best friend in high school.
Speaker A:Now I was, I had the presence of mind not to let myself fall into that trap of having a crush on your best friend because I knew where I was.
Speaker A:But there, there's something to be said for the type of company that you keep.
Speaker A:They say that when we go out into life, if you had a healthy relationship with your parents, then you're going to seek out people who remind you of your mother or your father.
Speaker A:So while, and that's probably directly out of a page of Freud's book, I suppose.
Speaker A:But while I never allowed my friendship with my best friend to develop into a crush, I feel like the type of characteristics that he had in his personality were the same that I saw out in the Ideal Partner.
Speaker A:Now comparing it with the film that we're discussing here, it has some parallels.
Speaker A:I actually did not come out to this best friend until after my father's funeral and we haven't really spoken.
Speaker A:Oh well, he found himself in a right wing part of the country and while we never.
Speaker A:Neither one of us really dated in high school.
Speaker A:Shocker.
Speaker A:He ended up marrying a woman somehow.
Speaker A:We'll let Freud say the rest about that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So about you past and what was this here?
Speaker A:So did you have an idyllic version of the past and was there a situation that made you embrace an opportunity?
Speaker B:So as far as holding on to the past.
Speaker B:And I, I would, I would crush hard on people on long guys.
Speaker B:But I mean I would, I would crush really hard.
Speaker B:But I, I never, I knew they were not.
Speaker B:I don't know, they were.
Speaker B:Yeah, they were not, they were not mentally healthy for me anyway.
Speaker B:But so yeah.
Speaker B:And I would hold on to that for too long until you find a new one or you grow up and realize you're thinking of somebody when you were 15.
Speaker B:It's like there, that, that is not everybody's changed.
Speaker B:No, it's just everybody's changed.
Speaker B:It's like we're not kids anymore.
Speaker B:I'm not that person.
Speaker B:They're not that person.
Speaker B:We've all grown up and changed and Anyway.
Speaker B:But I would hold on to crushes for.
Speaker B:Until a new one came along.
Speaker B:Far too long.
Speaker B:But thankfully when I was 15, I fell madly in love with Corey Hart.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I had no other man in my peripheral than him for until I was in my 20s, so far into my 20s.
Speaker B:So I was safe with that.
Speaker A:Ironically, my first relationship, it was when I was in college, but it wasn't with a college guy.
Speaker A:It was somebody who was out of school.
Speaker A:And yes, they, they lied about their age at the time, but they were closer to my age than my longer relationship.
Speaker A:Anyways.
Speaker A:It's ironic that a young 20 something kid in college who's not even out yet.
Speaker A:Breaks up with somebody because they're older and they're not even out yet.
Speaker B:See, that's something I could not do now is.
Speaker B:I don't think I could do now is be with somebody that wasn't at least out.
Speaker A:And that brings us to a point that we can discuss in a bit here.
Speaker A:The, the, what do they call it?
Speaker A:The boy next door in this story, Dean.
Speaker A:And we'll talk about him in a moment because there are other parts of the story that are important.
Speaker A:Yes, but we know what's happening with the story.
Speaker A:We've got the, the main character there, Henry, he's gone back home because grandpa has had a stroke.
Speaker A:And then we get introduced to some of the other townspeople that we'll talk about in a little bit here.
Speaker A:But part of the problem is that that boy next door is back home because.
Speaker A:Yeah, recently went through a divorce and now he's brought his kids home and, well, he saddled his own parents.
Speaker A:So the grandparents are helping out while he gets his head screwed back on.
Speaker A:But Matt, the person behind the camera that was in charge of the direction, the vision, the, the cinematography of this story, Big Eden sets the stage.
Speaker A:Who was the person behind the camera.
Speaker B:For Big Eden in that would be Thomas Bazooka.
Speaker B:Bazooka.
Speaker B:Bazucha.
Speaker B:Oh, just like the gum, I guess.
Speaker B:I, I sorry, Thomas.
Speaker B:I don't know how to pronounce your name correctly.
Speaker B:But anyway, he was.
Speaker B:He's a writer, director and producer.
Speaker B:And of course he's best known for this film.
Speaker B: He was born in: Speaker B:Gay, romance, small town, etc.
Speaker B:Etc.
Speaker B:But anyway, he went to.
Speaker B:To direct a few other films and you probably have not heard of these.
Speaker B:One of us is called the Family Stone, which is like a Christmas staple for me.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And then Monte Carlo and let him go.
Speaker B:Now he is openly gay, thankfully.
Speaker B:And he explores seems like family belonging, personal identity.
Speaker B:And his storytelling is considered to be very thoughtful and character driven and earned him a very respected place in independent and mainstream cinema.
Speaker B:And I'm telling you for, for this being his debut film.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:Yes, wow.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:As I mentioned, I had not seen this film before Matt and I discussed it today, so there's a lot to unwrap with this.
Speaker A:But talking about Mr. Bazooka's body of work there, Family Stone, as you said, is a favorite Christmas film of yours.
Speaker A:Now if you have not seen the Family Stone, folks.
Speaker A:This movie is one where you only have to have a couple of reasons to see it.
Speaker A:One of them is Sarah Jessica Parker is playing the daughter in law to be.
Speaker A:And then of course, and I'm forgetting his name, but he was the star of Coach on tv.
Speaker A:He plays the dad.
Speaker A:And then of course, one of the main reasons for seeing the Family Stone is the dearly beloved.
Speaker A:A dearly departed Diane Keaton was the mom in this movie.
Speaker A:And spoiler alert for a movie that's 20 plus years old, her character ends up passing, which in more recent years makes it hard to watch because of course, we lost Diane recently.
Speaker A:So, yes, it kind of comes full circle.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And there's a wonderful gay storyline in there too.
Speaker B:And the gay character is deaf, so that was interesting as well.
Speaker A:Yes, a twofold diversity in that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Well, we are celebrating the pride season and this is our second film exploring the realm.
Speaker A:And so I thought I would take a moment to retell part of the story of Big Eden because of the.
Speaker A:Of course, we're only discussing the film and there's only so much time to tell you what color the carpet was and what, what the pattern of the dishes were.
Speaker A:But there is a critical moment in the film Big Eden where the characters of Dexter or Pike, Dexter, who's the strong and silent man who runs the general store, and Henry Hart, who is the small town boy who's gone to the city and has come back or to take care of his grandpa.
Speaker A:So these, these two hadn't spent much time together because they weren't in the same class in school.
Speaker A:They, they went to the same school, but they weren't in classes together.
Speaker A:But the strong and silent guy, he was shy and Henry really had no reason to pay attention to him.
Speaker A:Well, there's a scene in the movie that is actually right about the midway part.
Speaker A:So Henry is a artist.
Speaker A:He actually does paintings and he has made a painting of the night sky there in Big Eden.
Speaker A:And as he's revealing this painting to pike, it reminds pike of a story that's been passed down through the generations.
Speaker A:Now, pike is a man who is from northwestern Montana, which is.
Speaker A:Is where Big Eden is supposed to take place.
Speaker A:However, we don't really know the origin of his peoples.
Speaker A:He is an indigenous person, a Native American.
Speaker A:But the only, the only, the only element of history that we get shared in this film is from a people called the Onondaga, who are actually not even from that part of the country.
Speaker A:They're actually a tribe that comes From New York State.
Speaker A:Hello.
Speaker A:So, anyways, this is the Onondaga story, which is told by Eric Schweig, the actor who plays pike in this film, interpreted by the director Thomas Bazooka.
Speaker A:Because this is a folk tale, it's passed down by word of mouth.
Speaker A:So the story is, as they're sitting down at dinner, pike and Henry discussing this painting.
Speaker A:Pike retells the story that there is an Onondaga story about the stars.
Speaker A:They say that a long time ago, there were seven children who used to steal away into the forest to dance.
Speaker A:It was a secret dance, a dance they knew they shouldn't be doing, but they couldn't stop.
Speaker A:They were so lighted and they were so light, and they danced so hard that their feet left the earth and they began to fly, float up into the night sky.
Speaker A:They kept going up and up until they reached the heavens and they became the cluster of stars that we call the Pleiades.
Speaker A:And the Onondaga say that if you look closely, you can see that they are still dancing.
Speaker A:And every now and then, one of those children gets homesick.
Speaker A:They leave the sky to visit Earth again.
Speaker A:And that's what a falling star is.
Speaker A:It's just one of those children coming home.
Speaker A:Now, that's not exactly the version that's told in the movie.
Speaker A:It's the closest that I could find.
Speaker A:But it's an important moment because Henry, who has his heart set on his life in the big city, has only been inconvenienced.
Speaker A:He's been brought home, and he's not necessarily paying attention to the opportunities there at home.
Speaker A:But there's that critical moment where the art that he's created is being appreciated by this gentle giant who's sharing a meal with him.
Speaker A:Finally, through the course of the movie, many meals pass through this door of the older gentleman.
Speaker A:Grandpa, who can't cook for himself and his grandson isn't much help in the kitchen.
Speaker A:So they get all these meals that pass through the door, and they just assume that the.
Speaker A:The kindly widow and town is the one who's making it.
Speaker B:Oh, no.
Speaker A:We'll get into that in a minute here.
Speaker A:But pike has a hand in that, so.
Speaker B:Well.
Speaker B:And if you remember, in the very.
Speaker B:In the beginning part, pike, like, knew about Henry's exhibit and that several of his paintings were sold.
Speaker B:And, like, he knew about all that, and he would.
Speaker B:He was, like, following Henry's career, like, online and stuff, so.
Speaker A:So, Matt, you're talking about the talent in the cast.
Speaker A:Yes, the director.
Speaker A:But then we also have the.
Speaker A:A person that's playing the main part here.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:And do you want to flip since I was just talking?
Speaker B:Well, I guess I can flip, although it's never been my role before.
Speaker B:All right, well, let's talk about Ari Gross.
Speaker B:Okay, so I actually love this guy.
Speaker B:I followed him since he was on Ellen, but we'll talk about that in a second.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:He came out green in honor of St. Patrick's Day.
Speaker B:And he was born in Los Alges, Los Angeles.
Speaker B:Grew up in a creative family, developed an interest in acting at a very young age.
Speaker B:And he studied theater and went on to build a very successful film, television, television and stage production career.
Speaker B:Now, of course, he's known for Big Eden, which is still one of his more notable roles.
Speaker B:And he's also been in Soul Man.
Speaker B:Okay, we'll talk about that next year, girl.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:But later, he was known from Ellen, where he, in the first two seasons of the Ellen show called no friend.
Speaker B:These friends of mine.
Speaker B:He was.
Speaker B:He was like her best friend, I think, anyway.
Speaker B:But he's very intelligent, he's very approachable.
Speaker B:He has a great screen presence and has enjoyed a career spanning four decades.
Speaker B:And despite working steadily in Hollywood, he's generally kept his personal life private.
Speaker B:So we don't really know what's up with Mr.
Speaker A:Gross there, just that he keeps the lights on.
Speaker B:Yes, exactly.
Speaker B:Week.
Speaker B:But he had 130 plus acting credits.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker B:I know, right?
Speaker B:I'm just totally like, what?
Speaker B:But he's been so his top projects that he's been in were Big Eden, of course, Ellen, Soul Man.
Speaker B:We'll talk about that later.
Speaker B:And we have Tequila Sunrise, where he was in that with Michelle Gibson and Kurt Russell and Michelle Pfififer.
Speaker B:Michelle Pfeiffer.
Speaker B:And then he was also in Castle with a recurring role as a medical examiner, Sydney Pearlmutter.
Speaker B:Okay, but.
Speaker B:But anyway, he became like a fan favorite, so they kept bringing him back on.
Speaker A:You know what I remember about Castle?
Speaker A:It's got that pretty boy that was in Firefly.
Speaker B:Oh, dear goodness.
Speaker B:Captain Mal.
Speaker B:Anyway, so how many of his projects have you seen?
Speaker A:It's interesting because when we have actors who often play supporting roles, you lose sight of things they've been in.
Speaker A:So I went through the list of all the things that Mr.
Speaker A:Gross has been in, and I've actually seen more than I thought thought.
Speaker A:I've seen six of his movies and wow.
Speaker A:I will say that of the movies I've seen him in that I knew he was in my favorites.
Speaker B:Now.
Speaker A:Thank you for introducing me.
Speaker A:Matt vis a vis Tom, who's Big Eden now, and for the boys, because of course, I'm a sucker for a Bette Midler movie.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Oh, I am too.
Speaker B:But not into that one.
Speaker B:So that's awesome.
Speaker B:So I've seen, seen 10.
Speaker B:And of course Ellen.
Speaker B:My favorites were Ellen and Big Eden because I mean, this movie is just so delightfully wonderful.
Speaker A:So, yeah, it's got such a big heart to it.
Speaker A:You, you have your typical small town story where the kid has to leave the big city and go home, but then things are a little different.
Speaker A: , blah, blah, okay, maybe for: Speaker A:This is the type of story that is really reality because we are living through times now where kids who graduate from high school don't know what it's like to be told that you can't marry the person that you're attracted to.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker B:That's one of the things I once said about that when marriage equality in the US Became a thing that like all the plays and the movies and TV shows that all talked about the struggle of not being able to have that right beforehand became historical.
Speaker B:They became historical documents.
Speaker B:So anyway, yeah, but Big Eden, just brilliant.
Speaker B:And the thing is, is that the emotional parts were so real, it was so well done.
Speaker A:And it's worth saying that for one of the main characters being the strong and silent type, there was quite a bit of talent on display there because the character had to be awkward and you had to sense that there were things that he wanted to say but couldn't.
Speaker A:And through his body language, you had to interpret that he's leaving right now because he's uncomfortable.
Speaker A:He's been invited to share the meal with them several times and he always has an excuse to leave.
Speaker A:And of course, there comes a point when that excuse doesn't.
Speaker A:Where that excuse doesn't hold water.
Speaker A:And we'll talk about that more having to do with that starry sky there.
Speaker A:But we're in the middle, we're in the crux.
Speaker A:This is the meat and the sandwich.
Speaker A:So the conflict and the like the bread and the sandwich, the rising action.
Speaker A:So in Big Eden, the conflict centers on Henry Hart's because what else would you give the last name for a character like this Hart, Struggle to move beyond exactly.
Speaker A:Struggles to move beyond the past and open himself to love.
Speaker A:After returning to Montana to care for his grandfather, Henry finds himself drawn back into old feelings for his childhood friend.
Speaker A:He's an artist, he's going to be drawing.
Speaker A:But Dean, his childhood friend, who's now a single father and at the same time, Pike Dexter, quietly falls in love with Henry, but is too shy and uncertain to express his feelings.
Speaker A:Everyone just calls him Pike.
Speaker A:He's the strong and silent type.
Speaker A:And as the story unfolds, the townspeople recognize the connection between Henry and Pike and gently try to bring them together.
Speaker A:The rising action builds as Henry wrestles with his lingering hopes for Dean, while Pike's unspoken affection grows stronger.
Speaker A:Both men must overcome fear, vulnerability and self doubt before they can discover the possibility of a genuine relationship.
Speaker A:Now, before we do a little back and forth here, it's worth noting that when Henry gets home, of course, as every small town does, there's a mission for the ladies to fix him up.
Speaker A:Because Henry single.
Speaker A:And so of course the, the widow in town there, who's basically in charge of the ladies social group, played by Nan Martin.
Speaker A:And we'll talk more about that maybe in a bit.
Speaker A:She has set herself a mission to fix him up.
Speaker A:Well, even the old bitty in town is smart enough to figure things out.
Speaker A:What happens in the car after the first little social she's planned, Matt, where the ladies are all munching on the cookies left from the little luncheon?
Speaker B:Oh, yes.
Speaker B:So after she tries to set him up with like, brings over like three or four different women for him to try to see who she can fix him up with, they leave, they get in the car and they're all like, it's always the cute ones.
Speaker B:They're always gay.
Speaker B:Well, actually it's funny because if you think about it, I don't think in this film they ever said the word gay.
Speaker A:No, you're right.
Speaker A:They just, they just implied it's like that way.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So anyway, but that, and I thought that was really interesting.
Speaker B:But of course they, the, the girls after the luncheon, they, they're like, yep, we knew because.
Speaker A:Yeah, and it's just priceless because you would think that that would put a wrench in the works for the old biddy.
Speaker A:But she changes gears and it's like turning on a dime.
Speaker A:And we'll talk about that in a moment here because this is a story for modern times.
Speaker A:She's not going to be offended that there's one of those in her town.
Speaker A:She's got a new Challenge ahead of her.
Speaker A:And she's gotta figure out how she can solve this riddle.
Speaker B:And what does she do?
Speaker B:What does she do?
Speaker A:She organizes the quote unquote chess club.
Speaker B:That's right.
Speaker B:With all the eligible guys in town.
Speaker B:And I thought that was so awesome.
Speaker B:And Price was.
Speaker A:And it was so funny because all the guys are invited, of course, including grandpa, freshly recovering from the stroke.
Speaker A:And until grandpa speaks, you think nothing of the fact that there are all these guys just hanging out there.
Speaker A:And grandpa says to her, when are we gonna play?
Speaker A:Because of course he's under the impression this is a chess club.
Speaker A:And of course she says, oh, the big match is next week.
Speaker B:Week, yeah.
Speaker A:Little did she forget to tell him it was probably a wrestling match, but hey, sadly.
Speaker A:Conflict in the Rising Action.
Speaker A:M. Henry spends much of the film holding on to feelings for Dean.
Speaker A:That's the, the typical name for the small town boy next door is Dean.
Speaker A:And while overlooking someone who genuinely cares for him.
Speaker A:Have you ever found yourself focused on an idealized relationship and missed an opportunity was right in front of you and how that.
Speaker A:That make you feel?
Speaker A:Gmatt.
Speaker A:Spill your guts.
Speaker B:You know, I.
Speaker B:It would maybe.
Speaker B:I don't, I don't know if I, if I missed out on what was right in front of me, but I certainly probably missed out on other opportunities.
Speaker B:Having a crush and oh, it was a horrible, horrible crush.
Speaker B:Like an all consuming, like crying hysterically at home into the as I fell asleep type.
Speaker B:Because it was bad.
Speaker B:I was so in love with this guy and he just, he knew it and he used as an opportunity to like be emotionally abusive and he was just a horrible.
Speaker B:I. I want to say cuss words right now, but yeah, he was, he was very not a good guy.
Speaker B:And yeah, so if there were any potential suitors in front of me, I would have missed them because I just wasn't looking.
Speaker B:I was only looking at him.
Speaker A:Yeah, well, to your credit, this person probably existed in the real world, right?
Speaker A:Well, yeah, I mean I, I'm telling stories now because it's my turn on that question.
Speaker B:Okay, yes, let's.
Speaker B:Let's share the tea.
Speaker A:I mean there, there, there are a few chapters in the book of life between Matt and I.
Speaker A:So I came down, I came down, I came down the aisle a little bit later.
Speaker A:But I was, they.
Speaker A:I was kind of an early bird.
Speaker A:My, My friend.
Speaker A:First relationship with somebody my allegedly my own gender.
Speaker A:And I say allegedly because we never met in person was vis a vis the Internet.
Speaker B:And of course Nigerian prince that wanted to give you like a Million dollars or.
Speaker A:Okay, there was no request for money, but, yeah, it was.
Speaker A:It was troublesome.
Speaker A:Not in the way that meeting a person who's a bad influence would normally be, but because mom was a church going, conservative woman in rural surroundings who didn't want to have anything to do with the Internet being in her house.
Speaker A:Because what did Avenue Q tell us, Matt?
Speaker B:That, well, the Internet is for.
Speaker B:Is for.
Speaker B:Is for DIY for porn.
Speaker A:Yes, exactly.
Speaker A:So I snuck my way into the family office and I hooked up the Internet to the computer.
Speaker A:And, well, let's just say I found a way around those free trials and got myself onto the Internet.
Speaker A:And at one point, I had developed a relationship with somebody, or at least in my head, and I would make calls where you reverse the charges, like, basically collect.
Speaker A:So that was my first relationship, was vis a vis the Internet and chatting and emailing and making calls late at night.
Speaker A:Now, this person probably was either out of the closet or was like Dean, very conflicted, and he didn't want to be out.
Speaker A:But basically, when I tried to make things more serious, mind you, I was still in my teens at the time.
Speaker A:Their.
Speaker A:Their excuse for not allowing me to get closer was very, well, I don't know if it's not believable, but tragic.
Speaker A:I was told that they were allowing their elderly parents to live with them, and not only was it a situation of that, but that they themselves had the big C. And so I shouldn't get attached.
Speaker A:So it's like, okay, let's just invent the worst possible soap opera script and introduce it.
Speaker A:And now this person that I just had the jollies with over the Internet is not going to get attached.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:Needless to say, I didn't have my own.
Speaker A:My first relationship until college, which I'm thankful for.
Speaker A:Marriage equality in that sense that maybe there are more people in the LGBTQ community who get to actually experience having a relationship before they leave the shelter of their parents roof.
Speaker B:Maybe.
Speaker B:You never know.
Speaker A:So that brings us to the next question.
Speaker A:I think, man.
Speaker A:So the townspeople, they could quietly support Henry and Pike's potential relationship without judgment or prejudice.
Speaker A:How did the portrayals of community acceptance make you feel?
Speaker A:Especially.
Speaker A: keeping in mind that this is: Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:One of the things I loved about this film was that there was no, there were no, no characters that were against them, that were calling them names, that were saying negative things.
Speaker B:Like, every single character in this film was supportive, but it did have the small town.
Speaker B:We don't talk about it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But every single one of those characters that you would expect would have issues were all doing everything they could, even down to when they.
Speaker B:So pike basically taught himself how to cook.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:To make better meals for Henry and his grandfather.
Speaker B:Because the old widow, Pranky, Pinky, whatever her name was there, who was wonderful, absolutely wonderful character, couldn't cook worth poop.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But I mean, when I looked at that casserole with like the egg halves in it and stuff, I was like.
Speaker B:So anyway, when she was still cooking, pike was just giving them to his dog.
Speaker B:Poor dog.
Speaker B:But then eventually she came around too, and she was helping him cook.
Speaker B:All the guys that would hang out at the general store during the day, they were all helping him cook.
Speaker B:They were all in on this trying to get Henry and Pike together and.
Speaker B:But nobody ever said anything.
Speaker B:They just did it.
Speaker B:And I'm like, that's how it should be.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:The character in question, her name's Widow Thayer.
Speaker A:And I mean, not like that's a very memorable name.
Speaker A:Everyone's a widow something.
Speaker A:But Widow Thayer.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Widow Thayer is played by a.
Speaker A:A long and celebrated actress, Nan Martin, that we don't have enough time to talk about.
Speaker A:But to your point there, this is a small town community.
Speaker A:And rather.
Speaker A:Rather than them treating it like it's something that we don't talk about.
Speaker A:I thought it was very evolved in the sense that from these perspective of just telling the story, it's the typical small town attitude of it's none of your business even.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Even though while it's none of your business, as soon as your back is turned, they're going to be spilling the tea.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:But the best.
Speaker A:Well, one of the best sort of dabbles in that backstory of the widow Thayer supposedly being the woman who's making all of these meals the whole time.
Speaker A:Pike decides that he needs to learn to cook.
Speaker A:The sheer brilliance of the fact that pike is trying to save Henry from having to be subjected to this excuse for cooking.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because one of the first meals that he delivers to grandpa's house, he's not quite sure what it is.
Speaker A:And as you said, it was some dish that was topped with like deviled eggs.
Speaker A:And he says it's like chicken or tuna.
Speaker A:He doesn't know chicken.
Speaker B:Beef can.
Speaker B:Could be both.
Speaker A:And as the meal is being Carted away into the house.
Speaker A:He's talking to himself.
Speaker A:Pike is a strong and silent man who's getting back into his truck.
Speaker A:He's like, well, the applesauce will be good anyway, right?
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, but I think on the question there about the community acceptance, I'd like to that rather than it's the we don't talk about it, that they were gay, that it was, it's private, it's none of your business sort of a thing because that certainly is the, the tone, at least for small town communities.
Speaker A:Now it should be noted that with the character that runs the general store there, pike, he is obviously a man of, in of an indigenous people background.
Speaker A:The actor Eric Schweig himself that we're going to talk about in a moment is a person from a native people.
Speaker A:We are about the halfway mark in our show.
Speaker A: les, something from the early: Speaker A:Ooh.
Speaker A:So you actually got to smell what the room was, was like without that obnoxious carpet fresh that they use to try to pretend that no one's ever smoked in a room.
Speaker A:So maybe you're breathing a little bit easier.
Speaker A:There wasn't any Aquanet and the shoulder pads had gone away, so you had to be careful with how carried away you got.
Speaker A:There are times when it becomes a battle of will.
Speaker A:When gaining ground means losing blood.
Speaker A:When exhilaration meets exhaustion.
Speaker A:When the vision of your goal is blurred only by the tears in your eyes.
Speaker A:And either you have it in you or you don't.
Speaker A:Gatorade, is it in you?
Speaker A:What about the model?
Speaker A:Are you sure he isn't too gay?
Speaker B:Ladies, I'd go to bed with him anyway.
Speaker B:Hi, boys.
Speaker B:Getting any tonight?
Speaker B:Say hello to your son.
Speaker A:Oh my God.
Speaker A:I want you.
Speaker A:I don't believe love.
Speaker A:How come you're always following him around?
Speaker B:I'm not always following him around.
Speaker B:We're best friends.
Speaker A:I keep hoping that you'll meet somebody.
Speaker B:I guess it's me.
Speaker A:We're finally grown ups.
Speaker B:Don't say that.
Speaker B:Wendy will never grow up.
Speaker A:Jesus, look at him.
Speaker A:You've got to believe, right, Mike?
Speaker B:Like share.
Speaker A:You know, I approve of your lifestyle.
Speaker A:You like girls, don't you?
Speaker B:What the hell do you think you're doing?
Speaker A:Stick around here too long, you might wind up switching teams.
Speaker B:Queer Spoke coming out Sunday at 10 sharp.
Speaker B:Only on Showtime.
Speaker B:What do I know about performance?
Speaker A:What do I know about control?
Speaker B:Who do I know about grip?
Speaker B:Great horsepower Fluid.
Speaker C:It slips.
Speaker B:Rear differential.
Speaker B:Full time, all wheel drive.
Speaker A:But what do we know?
Speaker A:We're just girls.
Speaker B:Subaru Forester, sport utility dump car.
Speaker B:Easy.
Speaker A:Okay, so we are back.
Speaker A:Part of celebrating or recognizing Pride Month is the fact that we do have certain cultures that have been more appreciative of diversity in the past.
Speaker A:And it should be noted that part of Big Eden that is so refreshing is this character of Pike.
Speaker A:Because while we don't have much time to explore the character's background and the history of his heritage, the.
Speaker A:The people that the Canadians have called the first nations peoples have a history of being more inclined, inclusive of diversity in that people who may be not your typical heterosexual person, they embrace in their community in modern days, calling them two spirit, somebody who has an affinity for life that doesn't put them in a box.
Speaker A:And through the history of indigenous peoples, persons who were two spirit held positions of importance.
Speaker A:Importance.
Speaker A:Like healers and shamans and wise people.
Speaker A:They didn't fit in a box.
Speaker A:So we go to them for guidance and wisdom when we can't figure things out because their life's been more difficult than ours.
Speaker A:So I. I think I appreciated the fact that we did have characters that weren't just the boy next door falling for each other, which is the refreshing element of Big Eden.
Speaker A:It's not the predictable ending.
Speaker A:I'm not gonna give you a spoiler yet, but if you tune in to Big Eden expecting Henry just to fall apart when he finds that his old friend from school is back in town, well, you gotta pay attention, because halfway through the movie, the.
Speaker A:The tone changes a little.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:Or maybe more than a little.
Speaker A:And just an aside.
Speaker A:And the other thing that's really important about Big Eden is that for its time, the late 90s, is when we started getting the medications that were so important to people who had hiv.
Speaker A:And it was not a death sentence anymore to be diagnosed.
Speaker A:So now we have stories with hope, like Biggie, because now the characters in the story that are gay are not people who were going to have a funeral before the story's over, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, not for that anyway.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:Different people have funerals, but we expect that because they're already older when the story starts.
Speaker A:So, Matt, we talked about Ari Gross, who was the leading man here and who was his partner on the dance floor at some point.
Speaker B:Well, that would be Mr. Eric Schweig.
Speaker B:Or Schweig, depending, if you're German.
Speaker B:It would be Schweig, I believe, anyway.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:In Inuvit, in the Northwestern Territories of Canada.
Speaker B:He was born of Inuit and German ancestry, so.
Speaker B: e he began acting in the late: Speaker B:I think I said that right.
Speaker B:Oncas in the Last of the Mohicans opposite of Daniel Day Lewis.
Speaker B:What a breakout role.
Speaker B:Dude, that's amazing.
Speaker B:Anyway, he later appeared in films like, well, Big Eden, Tom and Huck and the Scarlet Letter.
Speaker B:And in addition to acting, he's an accomplished wood carver specializing in traditional Inuit art.
Speaker B:And he has spoken openly about his adoption and Indigenous heritage.
Speaker B:And his work has helped to bring greater visibility to Indigenous performers in film and television.
Speaker B:A really cool guy.
Speaker B:Now, he's had around 52 acting credits.
Speaker B:The top ones are, well, the ones that we just spoke of.
Speaker B:Last of the Mohicans, Big Eden, Tom and Huck, where he played.
Speaker B:I don't even want to talk about that film.
Speaker B:And then the Scarlet Letter.
Speaker B:And then he was also in Blackstone, and he had a recurring role in the acclaimed the End, the acclaimed Indigenous Canadian drama series.
Speaker A:So the only good thing that I will say maybe it's good is that that Tom and Huck series, or film, rather, had the home improvements.
Speaker A:Jonathan Taylor Thomas, who in more recent years is no longer in the acting realm, but he's one of those people who spent his childhood in the limelight and decided later that it's not for me.
Speaker B:Well, he should have not done that film.
Speaker B:I, I, I just cannot stand any Tom Sawyer stuff.
Speaker B:It's just, I don't, I don't know why.
Speaker B:Racism, well, that can be a big part of it.
Speaker B:But there's just, ever since I was a kid, I just have hated anything to do with that.
Speaker B:Without that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So anyway.
Speaker B:But how many of his films have you seen?
Speaker A:Well, I'm ashamed to say that I've only seen Big Eden.
Speaker A:You I know now, I mean, we were talking about crushes earlier, and I would have to say that of, of the two men in the, in the leading roles here, I think Mr. Eric Schweig is the type that, if I were single, I would rather have darkened my doorway.
Speaker A:But I, aside from having seen Big Eden, I'm really interested in seeing Eric Schweig in Scarlet Letter because I love Demi Moore.
Speaker B:It's very interesting.
Speaker B:It's good.
Speaker B:You'll like it.
Speaker B:I'm surprised you haven't seen that.
Speaker B:I'm also surprised you haven't seen Last of the Mohicans, because, I mean, That's.
Speaker B:That's a big one.
Speaker B:So, yeah, I go.
Speaker B:Go see those report back to me.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:But the Last of the Mohicans was a really, really good film and he was amazing in it too.
Speaker B:So, yeah, great guy.
Speaker B:For me, I've seen four.
Speaker B:My favorite, of course, is Big Eden.
Speaker B:I. I mean, I've seen the others, except for Blackstone.
Speaker B:Yeah, Big Eden.
Speaker B:He just.
Speaker B:He's.
Speaker B:He's perfect.
Speaker B:He's perfect in this film.
Speaker B:He just did such a great job.
Speaker B:Of course, now you were saying that he would be your crush.
Speaker B:Mine.
Speaker B:I would be the idiot that was like, with the.
Speaker B:Be trying to make it work with the best friend.
Speaker B:Because, yeah, unfortunately, yeah, he's.
Speaker B:I would be dumb.
Speaker A:I mean, the only.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:For me, the only downfall of the strong and silent was I actually dated someone who was almost seven foot tall once.
Speaker A:And it's impossible to find shoes for people who were tall because stores that do have them, which are usually like the last discount store, like Ross or Marshalls, the only shoes you're going to find to fit tall people are what I like to call the clown shoes because they're always the weird shoes.
Speaker A:For some reason.
Speaker A:The shoes in the larger sizes are like the floor model in the store.
Speaker A:They don't expect to sell it.
Speaker A:So they come in the outrageous colors that they would only sell at clown schools.
Speaker B:Well, if you go to, like, stores that specialize in stuff for drag queens, you probably find shoes there.
Speaker B:Although they might be high heels, I don't know.
Speaker A:Well, and then they're three times the price, too.
Speaker B:Oh, well.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Gotta have that markup.
Speaker A:Yeah, we.
Speaker A:We're riding over the ridge of the hill here because we've already figured out the complication and of course, the.
Speaker A:The beginning of the story.
Speaker A:What part are we at now in the third act?
Speaker B:Oh, we are climaxing.
Speaker B:Oh, yes.
Speaker B:And finding out the resolution.
Speaker B:You like to know more a little.
Speaker A:Bit at a time, please.
Speaker B:Okay, well, in the climax of Big Eden, so basically, Henry realizes that all the feelings that he's held for Dean and gone through therapy for.
Speaker B:For 10 years, et cetera, et cetera, are preventing him from actually seeing love that's been growing between him and Pike.
Speaker B:So after a series of like, heartfelt felt gestures and encouragement from the town people, basically butting in, but in a nice way, both men are kind of forced to confront their feelings and acknowledge their feelings.
Speaker B:And of course, there's that big blowout at Thanksgiving where.
Speaker B:And I love this the metaphor of Henry and Dean having it out in the closet.
Speaker B:So But.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And of course, in typical fashion, Dean blows it all up.
Speaker B:That it's Henry's fault.
Speaker B:Right, Right.
Speaker B:That Henry's being selfish because he won't make it work.
Speaker B:After Dean, like, ran away and got married and had kids and lived in a closet, and it's like, no, we can't do this.
Speaker B:And then suddenly, now that he wants to do it, it's Henry's fault.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Oh, and then, of course, he's dancing with the mayor at the end.
Speaker B:But don't get me started on that.
Speaker A:It's really every abusive relationship being retold.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Anyway.
Speaker B:But the emotional tension.
Speaker B:Okay, wait, I lied.
Speaker B:Okay, okay.
Speaker B:So emotional tension peaks between Henry, and he comes to understand that pike, not Dean, is the person that truly sees and loves him.
Speaker B:Henry and pike openly embrace the possibility of a future together, finally.
Speaker B:And their relationship begins to.
Speaker B:When the spirit of honesty and hope and mutual affection.
Speaker B:And it grows, right?
Speaker B:It grows the way good, real, happy, true love should, anyway.
Speaker B:But Henry also, like, finally finds peace with his past and a new connection to his hometown.
Speaker B:And the film ends, of course, on a warm, happy, blah, blah, blah and everything.
Speaker B:But we all think that Henry's leaving, going back to New York, and he finally chooses to.
Speaker B:To, like, stay.
Speaker B:And the thing that got me, actually, there was one thing.
Speaker B:So when the film is going on and everything, then there's this point that's like, what.
Speaker B:What are you going to do with your life?
Speaker B:Are you going to go back to New York?
Speaker B:Are you going to be here?
Speaker B:You've been here for six months.
Speaker B:And I was like, six months, right.
Speaker B:I was like, what?
Speaker B:Because it did not feel like they were there for six months.
Speaker B:But let me tell you, one of the most beautiful scenes in this film and made me cry.
Speaker B:I told you this earlier.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Is when Grandpa, who.
Speaker B:He's there because Grandpa had a stroke and they have some beautiful scenes together.
Speaker A:And by pausing you only for a moment.
Speaker A:Because there's an irony, there's a lot of subtlety throughout this film, but by virtue of the fact that they have the same last name, two men with that same last name talking.
Speaker A:What is that called?
Speaker B:A heart to heart.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Getting back on the rails so we can remain friends.
Speaker B:All right, so.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:So they're having their heart to heart and.
Speaker B:But they're on the couch and they're talking and Grandpa is trying to get.
Speaker B:Because Henry.
Speaker B:Henry never said I'm gay.
Speaker B:We never came out to Grandpa, and Grandpa was trying to get.
Speaker B:Get him to finally say it.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And he basically Grandpa's asking him these questions like, did I raise you to feel ashamed?
Speaker B:You know, did.
Speaker B:Did I do that?
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And stuff.
Speaker B:And Ari Gross's character, Henry, just breaks down crying.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And that was the most beautiful scene ever.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:It was so good.
Speaker B:And you just loved Grandpa so, so much, right?
Speaker A:Oh, yes.
Speaker A:Well, and.
Speaker A:And to your point, too, there's a little complication in the relationship because he's in his hometown.
Speaker A:You don't see Henry's parents.
Speaker A:So it's assumed that his parents met an untimely death.
Speaker A:So I'm thinking that Henry might have actually been raised by his grandparents.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, because he was.
Speaker B:Because there's that line in that scene.
Speaker B:He's like, chances are I'm going to be seeing your parents soon.
Speaker B:And he's talking about going to heaven.
Speaker B:And he's like, I need to.
Speaker B:I need to make sure that they know that I raised you right.
Speaker B:You know, I raised you to, like, love yourself and everything.
Speaker A:So this is a deathbed conversation.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And of course, then shortly after that, it really was.
Speaker A:And Henry.
Speaker A:Henry was clueless.
Speaker A:He didn't.
Speaker A:He.
Speaker A:He never came out to his grandfather.
Speaker A:And he also.
Speaker A:He also didn't catch on the signs that his time was limited with his grandfather because not only did Grandpa have a stroke causing him to have to come back home, but Grandpa also went back to the hospital at a point in the story.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:And he missed out on going to church.
Speaker A:As we were saying, these small town people, they weren't shamed by talking about gay people.
Speaker A:They didn't say, we don't talk about that.
Speaker A:It was just none of your business.
Speaker A:But they also.
Speaker A:This is an interesting story because as a small town would.
Speaker A:Community center is their church.
Speaker A:Henry is gay, but he still went to church.
Speaker A:And they didn't talk about him burning in hell.
Speaker A:They embraced him.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But at the same time, Henry was missing the warning signs.
Speaker A:That time with Grandpa was limited.
Speaker A:Grandpa is not feeling well.
Speaker A:Grandpa staying at home.
Speaker A:Grandpa is sleeping in.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And then there was at one point at the end where Grandpa does die.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And he was like.
Speaker B:And Henry says, I was.
Speaker B:I'm not.
Speaker B:I wasn't ready.
Speaker B:And he just was not.
Speaker A:But the best part about that was that the person who was there for him was Pike.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And he was the.
Speaker B:And pike was the one that found him too.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And some might say that by virtue of the type of characters that they were, I think that pike and Grandpa had similar personalities.
Speaker A:And if Grandpa.
Speaker A:Spoiler had lived on a bit Longer.
Speaker A:I think that pike and him might have become closer friends just by virtue of the fact that he would have been his grandson's lover.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker B:So, okay, all right, let me ask a question here.
Speaker B:So Henry ultimately discovers that the love he has been searching for was closer than he realized.
Speaker B:How did you feel about his decision to let go of the past and embrace the future with Pike?
Speaker B:Did it feel satisfying, surprising, or both?
Speaker A:I would definitely say it's both.
Speaker A:It's a little of everything.
Speaker A:This is one of the reasons why I enjoyed Big Eden, because the setup of the story made you think that he's just gonna go back home and fall in love with his best friend all over again.
Speaker A:But as his.
Speaker A:His art agent, Mary Margaret, sad.
Speaker A:He spent all that time in therapy trying to make better choices, make different decisions, and you can do no different than change your life.
Speaker A:I mean, this was somebody who he never considered as a possibility of spending time with.
Speaker A:And this wasn't somebody who just saw him and thought, oh, well, he's good looking.
Speaker A:It's like, no, I want life to be nice for him.
Speaker A:He didn't.
Speaker A:He didn't want him to have to eat the widow Thayer's food.
Speaker A:So he learned to cook, right?
Speaker B:Yeah, he was throwing his cap at him.
Speaker B:But, yeah, I. I think it was inevitable.
Speaker B:I mean, there was.
Speaker B:But I love the fact that it.
Speaker B:It was a slow burn.
Speaker B:And that's one of the things as being an MM writer, gay romance writer, is that there is a specific genre that is the slow burn.
Speaker B:And instead of the insta love.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:When you see a movie like this and they really do a fabulous job of showing you the slow burn, you.
Speaker B:By the end of it, you're craving it, you want it.
Speaker B:You want them to get together so bad, and they just did a wonderful job of it.
Speaker B:So I think it.
Speaker B:It felt inevitable.
Speaker B:I mean, you knew it was going to happen eventually, right?
Speaker B:But there was real chemistry between him and the best friend, too.
Speaker B:It was just.
Speaker B:The best friend was the one that was getting in his own way.
Speaker B:Because if he had come back and just been like, yes, Henry, let's, you know, sleep on it, the story would have gone a different way there.
Speaker B:But, no, but he.
Speaker B:He.
Speaker B:It was just a lovely, lovely well done.
Speaker B:Hey.
Speaker B:One of the.
Speaker B:One of the most unusual aspects of Big Eden is its overwhelmingly supportive and accepting community.
Speaker B:And honestly.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:How did the betrayal of the small town make you feel?
Speaker B:Do you think stories like this can change people's expectations about where acceptance and love can be Found.
Speaker A:We said it a little bit earlier, and I'm believing it.
Speaker A:I mean, my own hometown, I'm.
Speaker A:I'm a little biased.
Speaker A:I couldn't tell you that.
Speaker A:People would probably rise up through the ranks and not have the scars and bruises.
Speaker A:But as far as present day, I think that there's a hope of more acceptance.
Speaker A:I mean, we didn't say anything about it, but there were hints of the acceptance in this movie outside of people minding their own business.
Speaker A:When Henry G. Order was in his hometown, he ran into some of the people he went to school with.
Speaker A:And one of them was a woman who was in a relationship with another woman.
Speaker A:Her girlfriend and or wife brought her lunch to her.
Speaker A:So that was a pretty big tip off that things had changed since he had left.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And even in the, in the, in the.
Speaker B:In the last scene when they're having the dance, there's another male, Two men dancing together.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that surprised me too.
Speaker A:I mean, they were probably members of the chess club.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:It's funny because I actually thought that was the best friend and, and another guy, and I'm like, oh, well, he finally came.
Speaker B:But then you saw the best friend dancing with the mayor and you're like, girl.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker A:And yeah, and literally, as you just said, the mayor of this town is a woman that he went to high school with, so she's he.
Speaker A:Throughout the course of the film, Dean, the boy next door, is putting thoughts into motion that she's going to be his rebound because she's a single mom.
Speaker A:But there are some carefully planted scenes where she realizes this and she pushes him away.
Speaker A:Including one time when they are at a meal or at lunch, he reaches across the table to touch her hand and she pulls it away.
Speaker A:It's like, I know what you want, right?
Speaker B:It's like, girl, you are a closet case.
Speaker B:And I'm not going to.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm not going to be there for that.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But where were we?
Speaker B:So, yeah, the.
Speaker B:I. I loved it.
Speaker B:And, and the two things.
Speaker B:And it was funny because not actually saying the word gay through the film, I didn't realize how much that had an impact until, like, I was kind of done with the film.
Speaker B:And I'm like, yeah, they never really.
Speaker B:They just.
Speaker B:It.
Speaker B:They just were.
Speaker B:And that was a beautiful aspect too.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:And then the way that just everybody was supportive.
Speaker B:There was no negative thing.
Speaker B:And I'm like, yeah, okay, that may not be realistic in, in our realm yet, but that was just a wonderful way to do this for film.
Speaker A:A co worker once Asked me why I didn't refer to my husband as my husband, I often would say partner.
Speaker A:And my rationale on that was, well, as I was growing up and we didn't have the right to be married, most people used to call their boyfriend or girlfriend their lover.
Speaker A:And I just thought that just sounds so temporary.
Speaker A:I don't want to use that.
Speaker A:But as somebody who appreciates entertainment from outside our borders, Matt could attest that places like the UK have embraced different terms for people's spouses that are non gendered.
Speaker A:So by that I mean partner.
Speaker A:And in the UK they often avoid using terms of wife or husband versus spouse in favor of partner.
Speaker A:Partner.
Speaker A:And in fact, there was a recent piece of news that I listened to on, on a, a dance music station from the UK that National Health in England has actually done a study and is going to start including in some of the materials that they use in hospitals and whatnot, language where they don't ask people if they have a boyfriend or a girl girlfriend, but instead a partner.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because that's good.
Speaker A:When somebody comes into a medical facility and maybe their orientation, whether it's gender or sexual identity is not obvious, it's more in, it's more sensitive and inclusive.
Speaker A:If you just simply say partner.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:I, they, I, for a long time they tried to use the term significant other, but I mean your, your parents or your roommate or something could be your significant other.
Speaker B:It's like, it's who's your emergency contact?
Speaker B:So partner works fine.
Speaker B:I, I think it would be fun to be able to say husband.
Speaker B:But at the same time we do need something that is more generalized.
Speaker A:Anyway, yes, there was another shining star.
Speaker B:Why?
Speaker A:To quote the painting that was in this movie, in the sky of big Eden that shared the limelight.
Speaker A:Some might say she was a bigger star than our leading characters there.
Speaker A:Who was that third wheel?
Speaker A:Although she wasn't really a third wheel.
Speaker A:She was part of the salt of the earth.
Speaker A:She played a school teacher in this film, Grace.
Speaker B:She was.
Speaker B:Now it's very weird because I have this odd feeling that we talk about this actress like every other film.
Speaker B:It's like her.
Speaker B:And who's the other one?
Speaker B:There's one other one that keeps coming up.
Speaker B:I, I can't, I can't remember at the moment, but we talk about them a lot anyway.
Speaker B:But so Louise Fletcher, our dear, dear Louise.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:Which means.
Speaker B:And she's a Leo, I think.
Speaker B:Maybe.
Speaker B:Anyway, so she's born in Birmingham, Alabama and she was the daughter of deaf parents, so she learned to communicate through sign language before actually developing an interest in acting or anything like that.
Speaker B:And after studying at the University of Northern Cal, North Carolina at Chapel Hill, she moved to Hollywood and became.
Speaker B:Just ended up with a long, amazing career.
Speaker B:And of course she's best known for her Academy Award winning performance as Nurse Ratchet in.
Speaker B:In One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest.
Speaker A:It's medication time.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Who is one of cinema's most memorable villains.
Speaker B:Even though she didn't have like a lot of screen time in there, she stood out so much.
Speaker B:So of course she's been in Big Eden, but also Flowers in the Attic, numerous television series like Star Trek, next.
Speaker A:Deep Space Nine.
Speaker B:It's Nine.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B: d to producer Jerry Bick from: Speaker B:She has two sons.
Speaker B: sadly she left us at, in, in: Speaker B:But her legacy lives on in 132 acting credits.
Speaker A:Oh, more than Ari Gross.
Speaker B:Ah, yeah.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker B:So her.
Speaker B:So her most notable films are of course One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Star Trek, Deep Space Nine.
Speaker A:Your eminence.
Speaker B:I'm Kai Nguyen.
Speaker B:I am.
Speaker B:Oh, I am.
Speaker A:Hey, did you know that that was actually her own hair?
Speaker A:I looked it up.
Speaker A:I thought that complicated headpiece, that had to have been a wig.
Speaker A:No, Louise Fletcher had long locks.
Speaker A:And she told stories at conventions about how they put her hair into that get up because the hat and the hair all together felt like she was carrying the Sydney Opera House on her head.
Speaker B:Yes, but she.
Speaker B:And then of course, Flowers in the Attic.
Speaker B:That was from 87.
Speaker B: And then brainstorm: Speaker B:And then Big Eden.
Speaker B:But then another notable role that we talked about was VR5.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:And then she was in that remake of Invaders from Mars that we discussed this season.
Speaker B:Yeah, we don't want to talk about that.
Speaker A:She was the creepy science teacher who ate the frog.
Speaker B:So yeah, we talk about her like every other episode.
Speaker B:I think she, she's pretty awesome.
Speaker A:She's like the, she's like the roommate on Three's Company.
Speaker A:Forgot the other one was Come and Knock on our door.
Speaker A:So of all those films, Matt, I've seen four.
Speaker A:Some of them with.
Speaker A:Some of them with.
Speaker A:Of course my favorites are of now Big Eden.
Speaker A:Thanks again.
Speaker A:And Deep Space Nine.
Speaker A:Now I've been meaning to see that 83 film because Christopher Walken, just like Natalie or I Just like Louise Fletcher plays a good villain and he does play creepy good.
Speaker A:But it's also important to note that brainstorm from 83 was also Natalie Wood's last film, so.
Speaker A:Oh, a little piece of trivia there.
Speaker A:I'm looking forward to that.
Speaker A:Now you may not be aware of this folks.
Speaker A:I have only recently become aware of it.
Speaker A:It's like I fell asleep in history class.
Speaker A:I've recently been watching Deep Space Nine over again for the first time because it came on when I was finishing high school and going into college.
Speaker A:So I missed some of those moments.
Speaker A:But did you know that Louise Fletcher's Kai Wynn, the leader of the spiritual movement on Bayshore, she was responsible for the death of Jadzia Dax because she shot down, she shut down the showdown on the station when the forces of good and evil were going to have a showdown.
Speaker A:And later on they came back and they, they, they killed the pretty lady.
Speaker B:Yeah, she was not a nice character.
Speaker B:She was very power driven.
Speaker B:So, so I've actually seen Nine, but my favorites are of course Big Eden and Star Trek Deep Space Nine.
Speaker B:Because she will always be Kai Win to me.
Speaker B:No matter when I see her or what I see her in, I'm always like, it's Kai Win.
Speaker B:So yeah, child, child, I will do absolutely what's wrong because I think it will bring me power and then I'll regret it.
Speaker B:But I'll still turn out to be evil.
Speaker A:Child, go back to my dressing room and fish out all the green M.
Speaker B:And Ms. Child, Undo my hair from the Sydney Opera House.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:So, okay.
Speaker A:There were some other folks that shared the limelight.
Speaker A:They didn't get as much screen time but of those included Tim Decay as Dean, the handsome boy next door.
Speaker B:Yes, and he was quite, and Tim.
Speaker A:Has appeared in numerous TV shows and films including Carnival.
Speaker A:He was also in the, I want to say Fox series part yes 5 and then the more recent movie with Benedict Cumberbatch Oppenheimer about the, the atomic bomb.
Speaker A:And also in Big Eden of course, he plays Henry, long, long time friend and former romantic interest.
Speaker A:Now we won't spend much time on this, but I wonder if after all is said and done, do you think that Henry and Dean were still on speaking terms?
Speaker B:Oh yeah, I, I, I imagine once he was firmly in love with, with pike and I, I think that Tim finally would probably, Tim Dean would finally move on from him.
Speaker B:And I think that also being in such a supportive town, he probably would finally like either realize that he's bi or gay or whatever and find someone I mean, he's pretty easy on the eyes, so he would have found me.
Speaker B:I mean, someone.
Speaker A:The Fuller, The Fuller Brush man.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:He's.
Speaker B:He's now 63 years old.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Oh, okay.
Speaker A:So he's done.
Speaker A:He's almost done paying for the lights to be on.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:So the, the person that played Grandpa, and it was cute because Henry and, well, Henry had his own little nickname for Grandpa because of course, he was a stand in father for him.
Speaker A:So he called him, what, Matt?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Papa?
Speaker A:No, he called him.
Speaker A:He called him Sampa, A combination of Grandpa and Sam.
Speaker B:Oh, I didn't catch that.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:It's amazing what you catch when you put captions on like us old folks do.
Speaker B:I do, but I guess I just.
Speaker B:I still didn't catch that.
Speaker B:Probably just thought it was an error.
Speaker C:Oh.
Speaker A:So George Coe was the grandfather in this film, Sam Hart.
Speaker A:He's an accomplished actor, a producer also, and a voice performer.
Speaker A:He earned an Academy Award nomination for producing the short film the Dove and was an original cast member of Saturday Night Live.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:He was also known for roles in Kramer vs Kramer, which was that Dustin Hoffman movie.
Speaker A:He was in Max Headroom and numerous animated series.
Speaker A: him before Louise Fletcher in: Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:Who was the widow Thayer?
Speaker A:Matt.
Speaker B:Oh, just give me a moment here.
Speaker B:I was looking up George Coe because I didn't remember Saturday Night Live.
Speaker B:Okay, so Nan.
Speaker B:Nan.
Speaker B:As we talked about Ms. Nan Martin, she.
Speaker B:Okay, so Nan Martin was Mabel.
Speaker B:And she appeared in productions such as the American President, Shallow Hal, and television series such as Frasier.
Speaker B:Now she was a very respected character actress.
Speaker B: then she passed away sadly in: Speaker B:She was 82.
Speaker B:And let me tell you, I think that woman got more work when she was older because she was that per.
Speaker B:Oh, she was the iconic, perfect, like, troublesome HOA type neighbor character.
Speaker B:And so that was so wonderful to see her in this because you expected her to kind of be the, the negative Nancy.
Speaker B:And she was one of the ones who were trying to set him up with everybody she could.
Speaker A:Yeah, I love that she turned on a dime.
Speaker A:And it was, it wasn't, it wasn't unthinkable for her.
Speaker A:She's just like, oh, it's just a recipe.
Speaker A:Different recipe and different ingredients.
Speaker B:Right, exactly.
Speaker B:So that's another reason she was so wonderful in this.
Speaker B:But now we did have some Star Trek connections.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:More than just the one that we know of.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So, of course, the, the lady that wore The Sydney Opera House.
Speaker A:Ms. Louise Fletcher, she was Vedic.
Speaker A:And then later kai win in 14 episodes of Deep Space Nine.
Speaker A:So she could probably tell you the menu at craft services there.
Speaker B:She.
Speaker B:And she was iconic in that series.
Speaker B:And then, of course, we had George Coe.
Speaker B:He actually played the Malkorian chancellor Avel Durkin in Star Trek the Next Generation episode First Contact.
Speaker A:The movie.
Speaker B:Now that I did.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's why I was like, wait a minute, that's the movie.
Speaker A:Oh, wait, no, it wasn't the movie.
Speaker A:It was an episode that was the.
Speaker A:That's also the episode that in.
Speaker A:Here's a throwback to Frasier that Nan Martin was in.
Speaker A:Because B.B.
Speaker A:Bish, who plays Lilith, was in the episode of Star Trek the Next Generation, First Contact, because she was the alien woman that first fell in love with Commander Riker.
Speaker A:Because, yes, she.
Speaker A:She had.
Speaker A:It's all about how they were different, of course, because of the alien of the week was just a different prosthetic.
Speaker A:And BB Vish was playing this character that had sort of skin folds on her forehead to make her look like an alien.
Speaker A:But she was fascinated because a man who was not from her species was visiting her place planet and she wanted to figure out how he ticked or what made him tick.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And that.
Speaker A:That basically involved her sorting through the layers of the laundry point.
Speaker B:I mean, well, it shows you how long I. I haven't watched that.
Speaker B:Which.
Speaker B:Okay, so which episode, which series of Star Trek do you think that you have watched the most?
Speaker A:Oh, well, I. I'm Deep Space Nine because all of the other series had either had its run or were mid run by the time I caught them.
Speaker A:So Next Gen was mid run when I became a fan.
Speaker A:Deep Space Nine is the first series that I got to watch from the premiere to finish.
Speaker B:And not Voyager.
Speaker B:You haven't watched.
Speaker A:I've watched Voyager.
Speaker A:It's just there were those boring years that we call the Kes episodes.
Speaker B:Well, she was not exactly the best character.
Speaker B:I was fine when she left anyway.
Speaker B:But that I have watched.
Speaker B:I've rewatched Voyager, I think, like three or four times, so I just really have liked it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Anyway, okay, so let's.
Speaker B:Let's just say was there a character that you wish had more screen time?
Speaker A:I actually, just being a Louise Fletcher fan, I think that her character, the teacher, could have had a little bit more time.
Speaker A:But of all the supporting characters, she probably had the most time.
Speaker A:So I think maybe pike, just because we don't know much about him, was.
Speaker A:Was this his family's store and did he inherit it when he grew up?
Speaker A:Because you never hear them talk about who has had the store before.
Speaker A:He's just the guy that runs it now.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was a little nebulous.
Speaker B:I, I didn't know whether they made a mention that he was like adopted or whether since he was adopted in real life, I just remembered from making the notes.
Speaker B:So I don't know.
Speaker B:But yeah, I, I could see that.
Speaker B:I don't think there's any character that I, I think needed more screen time also.
Speaker B:Although I think that maybe we needed a little bit more of Dean shirtless, because there was that.
Speaker B:And I was really surprised that he was like that, like together.
Speaker A:But I mean, I needed a scene with pike cutting wood, shirtless,.
Speaker B:That.
Speaker B:See, you would have expected that would happen at some point.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Did you feel the ending of the film was satisfying?
Speaker A:Oh, I, I've probably said it once or twice, but my favorite type of movie is the one that has a surprise ending, the one that you didn't expect.
Speaker A:And they almost missed the boat on this one because you've got all that tension, as you were saying, the slow burn, and you don't think you're going to get any.
Speaker A:To quote an old rock song, satisfaction.
Speaker A:But it eventually packed days off.
Speaker A:If you sit practically through the credits, I will say.
Speaker A:But I will say that for two allegedly straight men, that was a really convincing kiss because I, I think they know what they had for lunch.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:And, well, and the kiss that Dean and Henry had in the closet, that was a very nice scene too.
Speaker B:I, I think that the one thing thing is that except for the kiss that Dean and Henry had in the closet during kind of the first part of the film, and then that turned into a big blowup or whatever, this was almost a fade to black film.
Speaker B:Like at the end, you saw Henry and Pike dancing together and it was like, okay, are they going to kiss?
Speaker B:Oh, they're kissing.
Speaker B:And then they had a nice long, realistic, you know, wonderful kiss.
Speaker B:But if they had not had that, it would have felt a little like, oh, that's a very sweet story.
Speaker B:But it, it may not have had the impact.
Speaker A:It's like Bert and Ernie.
Speaker A:They're roommates.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, they're partners.
Speaker B:They're significant others.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Anyway, taking a moment back, though, not when Henry and Dean had the kiss, but one of the moments that led up to that, there was some tension outside of grandpa's house and Grandpa had actually left for the evening with Pike.
Speaker A:I don't remember the, the particulars but the.
Speaker A:The story is that they're coming back to the house.
Speaker A:Grandpa is in a wheelchair.
Speaker A:He has been through most of the story, but pike is pushing him back towards the house.
Speaker A:They get within ey shot of the house, and Dean is trying to make the moves on Henry.
Speaker A:So Dean is putting the moves.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Go ahead.
Speaker A:So Dean is putting the moves on Henry as Pike is wheeling Grandpa Sam back to the house.
Speaker A:And so despite the fact that Henry has not come out to.
Speaker A:To his grandfather, his grandfather has got a pretty good idea of which side his bread is buttered on.
Speaker A:Which, of course, makes the scene that Matt mentioned where they had their heart to heart.
Speaker A:Sorry, I had to say it.
Speaker A:Even more bittersweet.
Speaker A:Because his grandson didn't have to come out to him.
Speaker A:He knew.
Speaker A:And the better part of that conversation was Grandpa already knew.
Speaker A:And by virtue of the words that he used, by saying that God made him perfect meant that he didn't believe there was anything wrong with him.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:In that scene when they were coming back and Gene was trying to.
Speaker B:Trying to connect to Henry, trying to have that first kiss with him, trying to tell him that he had feelings for him or whatever, and he just.
Speaker B:Just couldn't do it and turned it from a potential kiss into a big hug.
Speaker B:And it was like, oh, dude.
Speaker B:Dude.
Speaker B:Anyway, yo, just a quick moleseness film fact there.
Speaker B:So both George Coe, who plays Sam, and Nan Martin, who plays Widow Thayer, appeared on the Golden Girl.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:But not in the same episode.
Speaker B:So you see how little actual trivia or fan there was in this.
Speaker B:But there's a little something.
Speaker B:I mean, Golden Girls is pretty cool.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So as we were talking about earlier, the.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The history, the culture of the character of pike was pretty important to this story of Big Eden, because even despite the quote unquote evolution of people's attitudes in this small town, potentially, pike might have come from a culture of people who were historically more acceptant of people who were different.
Speaker A:And by virtue of that and the fact that we are celebrating the end of pride season and Indigenous peoples in this story, I was just going to make an honorable mention of a personality, a Persona, a celebrity of the indigenous peoples.
Speaker A:And so during the pandemic, as we all became more aware of people making content on the Internet because we were stuck at home, I became aware of a indigenous person making content on TikTok, who apparently actually was previously part of the third season of Canada's Drag Race.
Speaker A:And this person's name is Chelazon Leroux.
Speaker A:And they're A two spirit, which is the name given by indigenous peoples for persons who may not necessarily be heterosexual or gay.
Speaker A:It's sort of a encompassing queer category.
Speaker A:But Chelazanne LaRue is a two spirited Dene D E N E. So maybe it's Danae, First nations drag artist that competed in season three of Canada's Drag Race.
Speaker A:And if you are somebody who enjoys short attention spanned content like TikTok, you might actually look for Shelazan Leroux because she has these terrific videos on TikTok and she's often talking about members of her community because in the ways of indigenous people there are kind nicknames for other people.
Speaker A:In the gay community we often say girl and in the indigenous community they talk about women or queer people as anti.
Speaker A:So look for Chelazanne Larue on social media there and discover a person of Indian indigenous background who is multi talented.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's awesome.
Speaker B:Okay, so now we're at the point where you need to narrow down a recommendation for our audience.
Speaker B:If they liked Big Eden.
Speaker A:Oh, this is the lip sync for your life segment.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Well, let's.
Speaker A:Okay, so we are at a point point where we're going to talk about things you might enjoy if you like films, independent films, LGBTQ stories like Big Eden.
Speaker A:And this is our snack tray.
Speaker A:So I'm going to go ahead and make a recommendation from a film that's a few years later after Big Eden.
Speaker A: t, but not totally, it's from: Speaker A:So set in a working class California, California coastal town, Shelter is a tender drama about family, duty and the courage to claim your own life.
Speaker A:20 Year old Zach is a gifted artist who has sidelined his dreams of art school to work, a dead end job and raise his young nephew from for his unreliable older sister, his only escapes are surfing and stenciling graffiti murals.
Speaker A:Zach's insular, self sacrificing world shifts when Sean, the successful, openly gay older brother of his best friend, returns home from Los Angeles.
Speaker A:Where else?
Speaker A:Bonding over the waves, Sean recognizes Zach's stagnant talent and offers him a rare space to be taken care of.
Speaker A:As their easy camaraderie deepens into a tender romance, Zach is forced to confront his family's suffocating expectations and choose.
Speaker A:Choose between remaining a martyr or pursuing his art, his freedom and the future he deserves.
Speaker A:By the director of Netflix's recent new version of Little House on the Prairie.
Speaker A: It's: Speaker A:I think you might enjoy that if you like films.
Speaker B:That's Crazy.
Speaker A:And I do hear tell that the new Little House on the Prairie may actually have same sex couples.
Speaker B:I did not even know that there was a new version of Little House on the Prairie, period.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Is that already out?
Speaker A:It might be.
Speaker A:I know that it's been being teased, so it might be one of those things where they are just releasing an episode a week or so, but supposedly it is at least on the horizon, if not already out.
Speaker B:Okay, I will have to.
Speaker B:To look that up.
Speaker B:Yes, I am now seeing that.
Speaker B:Oh, my.
Speaker B:Okay, well, that's very interesting.
Speaker B:Let's.
Speaker B:But I got something to recommend here now.
Speaker B:It's actually a heartfelt British coming of age romance about a shy teenager living in a London housing estate.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And he has a quiet neighbor who is struggling with problems at home.
Speaker B:Now, as their friendship deepens, the two boys gradually discover romantic feelings for one another.
Speaker B:Oh.
Speaker B:Supported by a colorful cast of family members and friends, they learn to overcome fear, insecurity, and prejudice.
Speaker B:Filled with warmth, humor, and an unforgettable soundtrack featuring the music of the Mamas and the Papas.
Speaker B:1996 Beautiful thing, a film widely regarded as one of the most uplifting and authentic LGBTQ love stories ever put on film.
Speaker A:Oh, yes, that is a beautiful movie.
Speaker A:In fact, I remember seeing it and thinking that Big Eden has a lot of similar big heart qualities.
Speaker A:Because it's a movie that when you watch it, you find that the people are more accepting than you watch would anticipate for the times that it was set in.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:We actually, I. I actually was the assistant director for the version that we did a Beautiful thing that we did here on stage.
Speaker B:And one of my favorite lines was, all this time you were in there doing the 70 minus one, so.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Anyway.
Speaker B:Hey, did you want to say anything?
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker A:So, as you might be able to tell, there's some sounds of fans and whatnot.
Speaker A:The air conditioning ain't that great in this old video store.
Speaker A:It's not going to be too much longer before we have to take a break because Lula May only lets us record the show on our lunch and.
Speaker B:Okay, let's.
Speaker B:Let's be real.
Speaker B:The place has to be fumigated, so.
Speaker B:So we're actually going to be gone for probably about a month while things are taken care of, if you know what I mean.
Speaker A:I mean, it's pretty bad when your boss is the landlord, but at the same time, the town people had a complaint about the condition of the building.
Speaker B:Complaint?
Speaker B:There were more pickets here than there were for the.
Speaker B:Nevermind.
Speaker B:I Don't want to go there, but let's just say the townspeople spoke and things have to be done.
Speaker A:Yes, there weren't quite pitchforks involved, but at least it's a voluntary shutdown, right?
Speaker A:So in hindsight folks, the layman's terms are there's just two more episodes before our summer hiatus.
Speaker A:That's something you should have with the doctor look at really honestly, if you've got a summer hiatus.
Speaker A:But we are going to be getting back together here for a couple of more times before we say goodbye for the summer.
Speaker A:And so let's go ahead and introduce.
Speaker A:Well, we gotta actually break that fourth.
Speaker B:Wall.
Speaker C:Next time on Matinee.
Speaker C:Minutia is a dark comedy directed by Martin Scorsese.
Speaker C:When mild mannered office worker Paul Hackett heads to New York's Soho district for a late night date, a series of bizarre mishaps traps him in an increasingly surreal nightmare.
Speaker C:As the night spirals out of control, Paul encounters eccentric strangers, mounting misunderstandings and absurd dangers while desperately trying to get home.
Speaker C: It's: Speaker A:Well, it was certainly a joy to talk about something that's a little bit more recent there.
Speaker A:I didn't feel, yeah, quite like I was digging out something from the stacks and having to dust it off.
Speaker B:Of course they still didn't have the cell phones, you know, but.
Speaker A:Oh, I know.
Speaker A:I mean, I think I remember my first cell phone being one of those ones that they called the Brick.
Speaker A:I had the little dial on the side.
Speaker B:Yeah, we, we had a car, we had a car phone.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was.
Speaker B:Anyway, yeah, we had, we had a car phone.
Speaker B:It was very interesting.
Speaker A:Well, I, I think that we're gonna say good night bye here soon because those kids, they are asking for some money and I'm not sure, quite sure that I want to be responsible for going into the register drawer again.
Speaker B:Well, Hector's already taken all the petty cash, so who knows, that's for sure.
Speaker A:Well, alrighty folks, enjoy your summer.
Speaker A:We're coming back.
Speaker A:But be careful out there in the sun.
Speaker A:Make sure you get your, your lotion on there with your SPF 30.
Speaker A:If you're fair skinned like folks like me and Matt, perhaps.
Speaker A:Yeah, and be careful of the, the ornery people that run your video stores because there aren't that many of them and they're, they're a rare breed.
Speaker B:And if there's a, a handsome older man yelling shark along the beach, listen and get out of the water.
Speaker A:Yes, and sometimes it's just the bathtub toys, but I'm not going to tell them that he's having flashbacks.
Speaker A:And so are we.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Thank you for listening to Matinee Minutia.
Speaker B:Our show is released on the first and third Friday of most months.
Speaker A:Find our group on Facebook.
Speaker B:Find our videos on Odyssey.
Speaker A:O D Y S E E. Follow us on Bluesky.
Speaker A:Dj is that DJ Starsaves?
Speaker B:Matt at sbamat.
Speaker B:Send us an email at Matt namemanutia at gmail.
Speaker B:Com.
Speaker A:That's all she wrote.
Speaker B:All right, Rue.
Speaker B:I guess I could stop the recording then.
Speaker A:I think so.
